Comments on: “I don’t have to say a whole lot, I can just walk into a room.”

By: Suricou Raven

Suricou Raven — Tue, 18 Sep 2007 23:33:19 +0000

See my example of a bad answer: “Humans are special. They just are. Dont ask why.”

Its all very well to say humans are different from spinich. Or cows. But you need to be able to say *how* before you can decide how to classify the ambiguous cases. Its completly unhelpful to just declare that humans are under different rules. There must be a *reason* for the difference.

And as the ‘god gave us dominion,’ if you will excuse me, I have to go and torture my cats before the family gets home.

By: Patricia

Patricia — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 20:48:31 +0000

God gave us dominion over the other species and plants. Do you consider killing a spinach plant “murder”?

By: Suricou Raven

Suricou Raven — Thu, 13 Sep 2007 00:38:04 +0000

I find it more interesting that pro-life campaigners are not usually vegetarians. They defend the right to life of an embryo so enthusiasticly, yet none of those I have asked so far were able to tell me why it is that a human embryo has more rights than, say, a chicken. They usually veer into either quantum morality (“Human rights propagate backwards in time. It may have rights in the future, so it must have rights now.”) or the groundless assumption (“Humans are special. They just are. Dont ask why.”).

As there is nothing to distinguish the embryo of a human (And this applies to the extreme lesser-developed end of the fetus stage too) from that of a cow, other than some genetic material that hasn’t yet done anything of import, it stands to reason that the two should be equivilent in terms of rights. And, as it makes sense that the moral worth of an adult cow is worth more than that of a cow embryo, all pro-life campaigners *should* be vegetarians. But they arn’t, because most of them dont really think their position through.

By: daniel rotter

daniel rotter — Tue, 11 Sep 2007 05:43:28 +0000

It would be interesting to know if “Patricia” opposes the death penalty. I don’t believe that it is hypocritical in and of itself to oppose legalized abortion but support putting a convicted murderer to death; however, I do find it amusing when people, in opposing the former, make arguments like “Patricia” did that could easily apply to opposing the latter…and it turns out said people are actually in favor of the death penalty.

By: Suricou Raven

Suricou Raven — Mon, 10 Sep 2007 23:11:27 +0000

Otherwise put:

“Abortion is murder, because I say it is. Trust me, I dont need to make an argument.”

Try to work out why killing a human is murder, but killing a cow is not. When you can understand that (And no ‘But humans are different!’ excuse for a non-argument!), you are half-way to formulating a view on abortion that isn’t based on knee-jerk reactions.

By: Patricia

Patricia — Mon, 10 Sep 2007 22:20:09 +0000

Life is a gift from God and we have no right to choose whether it should be ended or not. Murder is against the law in most circumstances. Abortion is murder.

By: Suricou Raven

Suricou Raven — Sat, 08 Sep 2007 17:01:52 +0000

Nicely done, s8… it didn’t even occur to me to question her story, but now you point it out… some of her claims hint at something off. Perhaps complete fabrication, but more likely just a great deal of exageration.

But remember the confirmation bias: Those who want to believe a story, probably will.

By: s8

s8 — Fri, 07 Sep 2007 18:42:56 +0000

Jessen has almost no proof of her story – just a single page recording that she was born as the result of an attempted abortion. All the rest of it is fantasy, as her mother has never come forward; moreover, there was never a prosecution of the clinic or doctor concerned, even though such a late-stage abortion was illegal at the time.
In addition, she always melodramatically claims that the saline solution used for the abortion “burned” her for hours in the womb (therapy helped her remember it, she says). Huh? It’s a mild salt/water solution – the *ocean* is a saline solution.
She’s made a career of milking the pro-lifers by telling them exactly what they want to hear. And they obligingly roll over and allow themselves to be bilked.

By: Suricou Raven

Suricou Raven — Fri, 07 Sep 2007 18:26:12 +0000

“Jessen, a Christian singer from Nashville, Tenn., said her teenage mother was 7 ½ months pregnant when she went to a Los Angeles abortion clinic.”

Seven and a half? That is just untidy. Abortion is an unfortunate necessity, but when it is the best option, it should be gotten over with *early* – doing so reduces the ethical problem, the stress on the woman and the medical risk of complications.

In most cases, that is exactly how it goes – late-term abortions are quite rare, and usually for medical reasons.